Some Masked translations
Aug. 22nd, 2010 06:33 pm![[identity profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/silk/identity/openid.png){kind=small}
mezzo-marinaio.livejournal.com posting in ![[community profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/silk/identity/community.png){kind=small}
bleachnessWell, I'm still in the process of translating Ishida's pages - though for now they don't seem to be particularly interesting, just a brief recap. *sighs*
In the meantime, here, have some more of Kubo's interview! :D
破面篇を通して変化したことはありますか？
“While you were going through the Arrancar arc, were there any changes made?”
久保・元々、破面篇を描き始める時に、敵をちゃんと殺す戦いを描こうと思っていて。尸魂界篇は誰も死んでいないんです。信じるものの違いだけでぶつかる、善か悪かではない戦いが尸魂界篇なんですが、ちゃんとした悪を描きたいなと思ったのが破面篇です。だから、敵がほとんど死んでいるんです。人が死ぬバトルっていうのを、今まで描いたことがなかったし。で、死ぬバトルを描いたんですが、特に“死んだ感”がなくて。それが発見かな。物語の中では、完全に死んでいるキャラが何人もいて、今後彼らの出てくる可能性は“０”なんです。だけど例えば、ノイトラだったらこんな時はどうするかな、とか、ちょっと考えてみたりしますよね。それって、実は“死んだ感”がないのかな、と。完全な悪で、殺さなければいけない敵という意識を持って描いたのに、描く側の愛着が変わらなかった、というのも発見ですね。他の先生たちがどういう意識で描くのかは分からないですが、すごい嫌なやつとして出てくると、「嫌な奴」って思いますよね？読む側がそういう意識を持つということは、描く側もそういう気持ちで描くのかなって思っていたんです。
Kubo: “Originally, when I started drawing the Arrancar arc, I was thinking of drawing some battles where the enemy is properly killed. In the Soul Society arc no one died. The Soul Society arc was an arc of battles with no clear-cut good or bad, where people clashed with each other simply because of the differences in their beliefs – but in the Arrancar arc, I wanted to draw what you would call bad. That’s why most of the enemies are dead. Because up until now, I hadn’t drawn any battles where people die. So, I drew battles where people died – and yet, they don’t feel particularly ‘dead’. That may have been a discovery. In the story there are some characters who are completely dead, and the possibility that they will appear again from now on is zero. But still, Nnoitra for example… what will I do with him from now on? I’m thinking a little about things like that, you know? I mean, I think there may not be really a ‘feeling of being dead’. Even though while I drew I was aware of the fact that some enemies are completely bad, and that I should kill them – the love held by the part of me that draws didn’t change… that too was a discovery. I don’t know if the other sensei draw with this kind of awareness, but… if someone appears who is terribly bad, you think something like ‘bad guy’, no? So I was wondering… if the part of me that reads holds this kind of awareness, would the part of me that draws write with this kind of feeling too?”
そんなことはなかった？
“And there was no such thing?”
久保・はい。描く時も、結局、最後まですごい嫌なキャラはいなかったですね。悪いところを描いていても別に腹が立たないんですね。だから、好きなところの範囲が広がったんじゃないかなっていう気はしているんです。キャラの良いところを描くって、実生活で悪いところでも、そのキャラにとっては良いところだったりする。その範囲が、尸魂界篇だと顕著なのがマユリとかで。マユリの中の意地の悪いところだったり、実験をしたりするところって、マユリの良いところでもあって。だけど、世間一般では悪いところ。それを良いところだなっていう認識で描ける範囲が広がったんだと思うんです。破面篇を描く上で。
Kubo: “Yes. Even when I was drawing, ultimately… there were no terribly bad guys up until the end. Even if I wrote them doing bad deeds, you don’t especially resent them, you know? So, I have this feeling… that maybe the scope of their likable parts has expanded? And when I write good sides for the characters… well, even if they would be considered bad sides in real life, for those characters they are good sides. Talking about that scope, a conspicuous example in Soul Society would be someone like Mayuri. There is the bad side of Mayuri’s will… the side that did those experiments and similar things – but he has a good side too. That in the common world would still be a bad side. I think with this ‘Ah, those are good sides’ realization – the range of things I can now draw has expanded. On top of writing the Arrancar arc.”
例えばノイトラが殺戮を繰り返すのも？
“For example, even Nnoitra’s repeated massacres?”
久保・ノイトラという人物としては良いところ。それがなくなってしまうとノイトラではなくなってしまうので。そういうところが、ルピだったり、ザエルアポロだったり、ロリだったりにもある。
Kubo: “For someone like Nnoitra, that is a good side. If that were ever to stop, it would be because it has stopped in Nnoitra too. That kind of side is present in Ruppi too, and in Szayel Aporro, and in Loli.”
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no subject
Date: 2010-08-23 08:16 pm (UTC)In which language does "Odel" mean "bad"? Bad joke to him? He sure takes her opinion very seriously given that she's something he looks down on and doesn't take seriously. He wouldn't otherwise freak out so much over it and think even during his fake death about how much it irks him that she thinks so little of him.
And if Tesla and Neliel were meant to be serious competition for each other then KT would have made them more equal in Nnoitra's thoughts. He only remembers a moment he shared with Tesla once, and then they talked about Neliel.
The only thing the two have in common is that they're almost the same height (almost, Tesla is taller) and I guess they're the same weight or something (?). I'm pretty sure their birthmonth is different. And they look nothing alike.
KT's interview suggest more that he wanted to kill Nnoitra but eventually got attached to him so he didn't. That doesn't indicate to me that he had always great plans for NnoiTes romance.
So because Zaraki used both his hands, Nnoitra learned that he must work with and protect Tesla? Even though nothing in his thoughts contained a blip of Tesla let alone indicated that the Kendo itself opened Nnoitra's eyes and stood out to him? GJ's and Ulq's (if he returns) plotlines are clear as water about what's important to them or will be in the future, even though it could spoil things, but for some strange reason I am believe that Nnoitra's plotline is so cryptic thet his most important will be the the person he thinks nothing about during his epiphany? Really? Not being included in that sort of thin spells death in KTverse for a ship, especially if the ship's rival is included instead.
Where do you see the Nnoitra--->Tesla love if by your own admission KT doesn't show anything because he doesn't want to spoil it?
How can you see something that is (apparently not yet) there?
no subject
Date: 2010-08-23 10:32 pm (UTC)I was being nice about the precise definition to avoid hearing about character bashing. Here, found it online: http://www.dict.cc/?s=odel . And here's how the same source is defining "Schwank": http://www.dict.cc/?s=Schwank . So yes, loosely it's "bad joke". It's not a very auspicious name IMO. I had an idea for "Nelliel", but that's been Kubo-ized too much to be certain where it got pulled from.
Nelliel and Tesra are almost exactly the same height and weight. There is the same use of green for both. Their Hollow forms are similar in both form and kanji. Their birthdays are a couple of weeks apart; they have the same Western zodiac sign. And they're both normally defined by their relationship to Nnoitra. Only one of these two relationships has been defined in canon.
There are two choices I see for Nnoitra using both hands: he either learns to work together with his zanpakuto (basically, the lesson Zaraki got from Ichigo), or he learns to fight together with Tesra. I don't see Nnoitra having a zanpakuto issue here, do you? Working with another also fits well with the hand-clasping thing Kubo has had going.
You asked why Nnoitra wasn't shown thinking about Tesra when he was struck for the last time; you didn't ask about a general overview of all Nnoitra's panel-time. We are also not privy to what he's thinking at the exact moment while he's looking at Nelliel. I'm sure Kubo will explain things whenever he gets around to picking up that loose end.
no subject
Date: 2010-08-24 07:49 pm (UTC)Yeah. Funny enough.
the panels work the same way. They see one another. This is the final moment Nnoitra has. Oddly enough, even Nnoitra feels this way. You don't think he believes he'll die? He ASKS ZARAKI TO KILL HIM.
http://static.bleachexile.com/manga/bleach/312/M7_Bleach_Ch312_08.png
Exactly. Their relationship has been defined in canon. NNOINEL HAS BEEN. Except on Nel's side. And Tesla's has been, except on Nnoitra's side. You don't believe me? Oh, let me recall how Tesla looked when Nnoitra said he wouldn't kill Chad..
oh yeah. He looked away. Because people who love each other do that. There is so much understanding in not wanting to look someone you love in the eye. I see the understanding. And Nnoitra throwing him after letting go of orihime, putting his sword to his neck after he defended him, and throwing his weapon at him for asking about Nel? That's all understanding. If NnoiTes is so deep and conclusive then why didn't Tesla just know these things? It's been years. And yet Tesla still needs to ask all those years later? Oh right, Kubo explained that. Or no, wait, he didn't. Furthermore if Nnoitra is letting go, then why does the sequence of events go as it does? His eyes widen! point for you, that's realization. Only instead of looking Nel in the eye and thinking clearly I HATE YOU which does not fit the logical line of thinking going on, he simply stares at Nel, and she stares back. "Weakness he despised, strength he desired...now he falls" Funny how he relies on Nel's words so often, makes even Tesla need to ask why he does what he does. All those years if he didn't care he could've claimed victory but he was waiting for her to come back. You cannot prove to me Nnoitra is not affected by her leaving. You don't look like this over BEATING SOMEONE:
http://static.bleachexile.com/manga/bleach/297/M7_Bleach_Ch297_02.png
He is looking down, cruelly. He just finished laughing, mocking Nel- and yet he's not laughing anymore. Nel doesn't respond, Nel can't respond- she doesn't recognize him, he gets angry. She can't fight him, he gets upset. She stops before killing him? He laughs it off and then tortures the person he wanted to kill to prove he was stronger. He lets his fraccion do it too. Nnoitra cares about Nel until the end and stares right into her eyes as he dies. If he cares so fucking much about Tesla- is his life long companion, where the hell is his look towards him? His eyes are blank- a sign that my anime buddy wyatt who hates nnoinel said 'oh well, he's dead' to years ago. He is not looking at Tesla, Tesla looks to him, and Nnoitra doesn't give two shits. The biggest indication we have for him even giving a shit about Tesla is him freaking out for 2 seconds when he died and Kubo saying he felt grief. Funny. You say how he wouldn't have just let Tesla follow him?
Incorrect again:
http://static.bleachexile.com/manga/bleach/313/M7_Bleach_Ch313_02.png
if you wanna follow me after this
If you want to
If you would like to
IF. YOU. WANT. TO.
Nnoitra doesn't give two shits about anything. He doesn't care if Tesla follows him. You say he makes this conscious concern about if Tesla is there? He doesn't. Like...at all. The thing is- he just doesn't care. Nnoitra literally just jokes and CHOKES IN DESPAIR his entire life and the only goal he ever seemed to have was to follow Nel's idea of strong. I can prove this. I have 390 times and I have a manifesto with manga panels, at that. I'll do it again sometime if you'd like.
I can accept NnoiTes. Hell, I love it.
no subject
Date: 2010-08-24 07:49 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 2010-08-24 08:26 pm (UTC)Rukia and Orihime are rivals in love and they are exacte opposites. The manga invites comparison between them by paralleling and putting them into the same situations. Your point?
The Kendo wasn't even mentioned in Nnoitra's thoughts and yet he learned a great lesson from this gesture and he connected it to Tesla even though he didn't think of him when he fell? Do you know what you're actually saying. You keep claiming that something that is not there is actually there.
And what has Kenpachi's Kendo to do with hand reaches? The hand reaches are about understanding and affection, the Kendo consists of the hans that belong to one and the same person. What?
Quality is more important than quantity. Every time Nnoitra talks to Tesla in the flashbacks, he looks away indicating that his mind is only half there and the whole things is a monologe instead of an exchange or an argument like with Nnoitra and Neliel. Tesla may defy Nnoitra on the protection issue, but other than that once he questions him he always backs nervously down once Nnoitra finishes answering.
Tesla shows traces of humanity and compassion, but he supresses it to please Nnoitra and be on his good side. He doesn't challenge him. He submits in almost everything because he fears Nnoitra's rejection.